rocky41_7: (lotr)


OKAY I know this has taken me a few days and I just have to say: it's the fault of my Sims laptop which I booted up again. I don't know how that game continues to suck me in for hours at a time.

Anyway.

I mean tl;dr incredibly negative, but let's break it down.

First, I think Sauron was contemptuous of Elrond. Elrond is someone who values peace and patience and kindness. If the Second Age timeline on Tolkien Gateway is correct, he establishes Rivendell as a haven for refugees the same year that Sauron tortures Celebrimbor to death for the location of the rings of power. Sauron, as we know, is someone who values power and is willing to go through any lengths to achieve it, as well as someone who desires to impose his will on others, believing he knows best. The Nazgul are an excellent example of this--Men he tempted to corruption, bound to himself essentially as slaves, and continues to support in their tortured existence well beyond when they should have been released by death. I think he would look at anyone as gentle as Elrond and think them weak and cowardly.

In Sauron's view, Elrond either has the ability to exercise more power and chooses not to, or Elrond lacks the ability entirely and either way Sauron finds him pathetic.

However, Elrond is also a direct descendant of Luthien Tinuviel, which makes Sauron reluctant to write him off entirely. He has not forgotten that whole clusterfuck. He never had to go toe-to-toe with Dior or Elwing because the Elves were busy destroying themselves, but I think for this reason he is also wary of writing Elrond off entirely. Furthermore, although at more of a distance, Elrond is also directly related to Fingolfin "challenged Melkor to a 1v1 and actually got several hits in wtf" Finwion and Turgon "can't find me or my city can you loser" Fingolfinion. He's unwilling to out of hand assume that Elrond entirely lacks the power to cause problems for him, because his family history suggests the possibility exists.

By the time of LotR, I think Sauron knows or suspects that Elrond has one of the Three Rings of course one of Luthien's brat descendants has one which also contributes to his ability to be difficult.

He would obviously prefer for Elrond to just be dead and out of the way, and I think he looks forward to destroying Rivendell simply to spoil one of the last Elven refuges that exist in Middle-earth, but there's a reason he didn't bring the hammer down there immediately. He's had enough experience with Elrond's family to want to handle him carefully.

rocky41_7: (Tolkien)

Relationships I want to know more about:

1. Turgon and Maeglin. What’s up with these two? Turgon took him in and accounted him among his house, and I can easily imagine putting a lot of effort into out of love and grief for Aredhel, even when it became apparent his own daughter did not get along with Maeglin. He even trusted Maeglin’s advice when shit started to go sideways for Gondolin--and Turgon’s not an idiot, so either Maeglin worked very hard to deceive Turgon as to his true intentions, or the job was easier because Turgon already trusted him. Did Maeglin feel guilty for what he did? Did he regret? Did Turgon feel he had failed his nephew if Maeglin had been turned to the service of Morgoth?

2. Finwe and the other grandkids. I’ve seen a fair bit of speculation of Finwe’s relationship with Maedhros and I tend to agree Maedhros takes a lot after him, but what about the others? Finwe’s whole thing with marrying Indis was out of a desire for more kids, so I have to assume he was a very involved grandfather. What did he talk about with Maglor? With Finrod? With Aredhel? I can totally see him as the type of grandparent to want to have a special little activity for each of his grandkids that was “their” thing, but then he ended up with 16 and started running out of time in the day lol

3. Fingolfin and Lalwen! We know almost nothing about Finwe’s daughters (they don’t even appear in The Silmarillion proper), but Tolkien elsewhere says that Lalwen went to Middle-earth because Fingolfin, her favorite brother, went. That’s a lot of love. Fingolfin and Feanor have the most prominent and explored relationship among Finwe’s kids, and not without cause, and we know that the Nolofinwean and Arafinwean families were very close, but please I really want to know more about Fingolfin and his little sister.

4. Fingon and Finrod. The text doesn’t give us much explicitly on their relationship, but we know the Nolofinweans and the Arafinweans are very close, and I firmly believe that even if these two were not particularly close back in Tirion (Fingon being closer with Maedhros, Aegnor, and Angrod, and Finrod being closer with Turgon), that changed on the Helcaraxe. I think the Helcaraxe changed the relationships for all of them, and made them far closer than they ever might have been otherwise, but for Finrod and Fingon, who both essentially operated as Fingolfin’s second-in-command, I think there would have been a particular sense of sharing responsibility. How did that impact their relationship and their interactions later on in Middle-earth? And what did they talk about on the Helcaraxe?

5. Tar-Miriel and Sauron. We can assume, I think, that Tar-Miriel does not get along with her husband Ar-Pharazon, but what was her take on Sauron? Did she also buy his claims of repentance and servitude? Did she think serving her husband a fitting fate for someone who had caused so much trouble in Middle-earth? Or was she skeptical of his intentions? We know she tried to flee the sinking of Numenor, and that her father had been devout, but we know very little about Tar-Miriel’s own beliefs. Did she follow her father’s path and resent Ar-Pharazon for his blasphemous acts? Or was she indifferent, merely seeing that as another part and parcel of Numenor’s cultural and intellectual decline? Did she foresee anything from Sauron’s arrival at court? Or was it just one more thing Ar-Pharazon did that she didn’t approve of? Did her opinion of him change over time--was there a moment she began to see him as a threat? Or did she overlook him until it was too late?

rocky41_7: (lotr)
I got this question on my tumblr this morning



So after work I drummed up my answer )



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